This is Erfurt #54 in Schön catalogue [Resolvido]

Hi there old coinlovers, 

I put this item in our catalog some years ago: 

N#95189

At the time I entered it as an Erfurt coin, but some months ago it was moved to Mainz. 

But now I finally got the Schön catalog and there I found it as item 54 under Erfurt and not under Mainz, so either I bought the wrong catalogue or did somebody make the wrong move here? 

The KM reference is also from Erfurt.

The 1770 A is Schön DM# 53, the other mintage lines are Schön DM# 54.

I was going to edit to move it to Erfurt but there's a bigger problem: Emmerich Joseph is only listed as a ruling authority under Mainz, no Erfurt. The same with Johann Friedrich Karl and Friedrich Karl Joseph.

While this type is identified as Erfurt under both Schön DM and KM there are other places where they disagree. The catalog Die Erfurter Münzprägung des Erzbistums Mainz von 1756 - 1802 by Rolland Gräßler considers most of the coins those catalogs put under Mainz as under Erfurt. (And looking at the coins there isn't any obvious reason to split the coins into two groups.)

When reading  the history of Erfurt on Wikipedia (in German there is an excellent page on the history of the city) we learn that from 1664 untin 1802 it was part of the electorate of Mainz, after which it went to Prussia. So any Archbishop-elector of Mainz in this period would als be the legitemate ruler of Erfurt.

 As the arms of Erfurt and Mainz are the same, there is no simple way to see the difference between the  coins that were minted in Mainz or in  Erfurt, but my guess is that mintmaster insignia are crucial here (they seem to be totally different from the personal in Mainz, which makes sence given the 300 km between them). Quite often the larger coins of Mainz show more elaborate arms, but the small coins seem very similar.

Apperently the mintage of coins in Erfurt was discontinued until 1756 and then restarted, probably reflecting the growing importance of Erfurt as a center of commerce (today it is the capital of the state of Thüringen), the palace of the Statthalter (sort of governer who ruled the area in name of the bishop) that was build in the later part of the 18th century, was so grand that it housed a conference for German rulers in 1808 and it also served Napoleon as a residence during his campaigns in the area. 

Hello!

What should be done here exactly?

Jarcek

Hello!

 

What should be done here exactly?

Would it be possible to post the “source” text for the move of N#95189 from Erfurt to Mainz? And, it that doesn't have a compelling reason, ask the person who made the change for an explanation (or to join this discussion).

You could also add the three ruling authorities I mentioned above to Erfurt, but that's just mechanical. It's more important to understand the reasoning behind how coins are assigned to either Erfurt or Mainz.

(A few years ago I looked at Erfurt and Mainz in in the 18th century in KM and Schön. My conclusion was that the country split didn't make sense in either catalog. Then I found Gräßler which puts most of those coins under Erfurt.)

The coin is now under Erfurt, and my request to add the ruling authority trigger a discussion which seems to clear the way to moving more of the coins back to Erfurt.

See https://en.numista.com/forum/topic145590.html .

All clear :-)

Out of transparency: I was the one who gathered all coins under Archbishopric, sorry for that. Now we have tools to underline cases like that (ruler groups)