Hey 1835 coin cross East India Company

Hey plz identify this coin 1835 cross flag it's very rare coin help me out

yes very rare, and looks realy funny..

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces4068.html

Just a tourist knockoff, not a real coin.

If you don't know what the coin is how can you make the frankly ridiculous claim that it's "very rare"?

Fishing for a sucker perhaps.

I'm no expert don't get me wrong. But I know my British India coins, they form a large part of my collection. There is no reason why the flags would be crossed on it as this isn't how the EIC's logo looked..

Can i buy ur cross flag coin.lil excoted to have 1 like this.

Can u giv me ur contact number so could i talk to u sir

Dear Sir

I have Collected Antique Coins for over a decade and among others, I also have Two 1835 and One 1842 EIC Cross Flag Half Anna Coins- They do not pull any rice but look very genuine- if interested, you may contact me at: jayanta2912@hotmail.com

Dear Sir,
I have collected coins for over two centuries, and have four copies to this unique specimen (nods to pnightingale   ) known in numismatics as the constipated twin lions variety.  It is extremely rare and am willing to pay in the upwards of a millions of USD for it.  Unfortunately the bank has had a misunderstanding and locked my accounts, I will need to to send me a money order so I can pay for the processing fees to get my cash unlocked.

Seriously though, it is a fake and I think some sock puppets are tolling you.

yes yes, very fake

Citação: jadejackalDear Sir,
I have collected coins for over two centuries, and have four copies to this unique specimen (nods to pnightingale   ) known in numismatics as the constipated twin lions variety.  It is extremely rare and am willing to pay in the upwards of a millions of USD for it.  Unfortunately the bank has had a misunderstanding and locked my accounts, I will need to to send me a money order so I can pay for the processing fees to get my cash unlocked.

Seriously though, it is a fake and I think some sock puppets are tolling you.

Damn sock puppet accounts are back... That does provide with a chuckle though ?

Dear Sirs
The word 'Fake' applies to Coins (Replicas) as much as it applies to People (self proclaimed 'Experts') -- First of all it may be pointed out, that there were Three Lions Not Two as some Jaundiced Eyes may have observed. Lord Jesus said "let there be Light" but it took a Thomas Edison many centuries later to invent the Electric Bulb which literally lighted up the World. So perhaps some half literate idiots need an education in History before they can gang up and shoot off their own Obverse sides:
There were Three Types of Coins that went around in that period in India: One- the Colonials had circulated (Machine-Made) like EIC, the Dutch, the French in the respective territories they controlled, Two- the Princely States had issued (Hand-Made) and Three- what many people and Revolutionaries (who were against the Colonial Rule) circulated as unofficial currency which were normally hidden in Temples and were dubbed as 'Temple Tokens' (Hand Made). Of course there are Fake Temple Tokens too but the Original ones belonged to the 19th century and are more valued than the official EIC coins.
The Original Coin weighs 10 gms and the flag was crossed to differentiate it with the official 3 Lion EIC coin and it was marked 'East India Company' to mark the Territory of its circulation... So the one in the pic (and those in my possession) may be Unofficial Currency but belonged to the EIC period and hence 'Not Fake'
J. Dutta, FICS(UK)

Citação: JDCOINDear Sirs
The word 'Fake' applies to Coins (Replicas) as much as it applies to People (self proclaimed 'Experts') -- First of all it may be pointed out, that there were Three Lions Not Two as some Jaundiced Eyes may have observed. Lord Jesus said "let there be Light" but it took a Thomas Edison many centuries later to invent the Electric Bulb which literally lighted up the World. So perhaps some half literate idiots need an education in History before they can gang up and shoot off their own Obverse sides:
There were Three Types of Coins that went around in that period in India: One- the Colonials had circulated (Machine-Made) like EIC, the Dutch, the French in the respective territories they controlled, Two- the Princely States had issued (Hand-Made) and Three- what many people and Revolutionaries (who were against the Colonial Rule) circulated as unofficial currency which were normally hidden in Temples and were dubbed as 'Temple Tokens' (Hand Made). Of course there are Fake Temple Tokens too but the Original ones belonged to the 19th century and are more valued than the official EIC coins.
The Original Coin weighs 10 gms and the flag was crossed to differentiate it with the official 3 Lion EIC coin and it was marked 'East India Company' to mark the Territory of its circulation... So the one in the pic (and those in my possession) may be Unofficial Currency but belonged to the EIC period and hence 'Not Fake'
J. Dutta, FICS(UK)

dear sir nobody believes your BS so stop trying, we all know the coin is fake

Citação: kolikko99dear sir nobody believes your BS so stop trying, we all know the coin is fake

What JDCoin is trying to say, is that you cannot simply state a coin is fake just because it is different from the "official" strikes.  N00bs think anything that is not an official coin is a fake   .  Due to this, the word "fake" is so overrated.  What needs to be determined is whether it is a "modern replica" indicating that it was struck to fool collectors vs. the other two types:

1) Contemporary imitation which is a counterfeit coin manufactured to dupe people during the time of issuance of the original coin.  

2) Private issuance of a coin (or token) roughly during the time of issuance of the original coin.

The last two types are collectible and highly prized by certain collectors whereas the "modern replica" is not.  As to whether this particular coin is a "modern replica", I don't know, so I will leave that to others to answer...

Finally, I wish people would not put "rare" and "please identify" in the same sentence.  They are contradictory statements...

Ok Quant.geek, that is what I wanted to state: it is not official.
Thanks for the correction

Correct.  It is not an official strike.  Now, what needs to be determined is whether these were "contemporary imitations", a private issuance, a temple token, or a modern fantasy coin (can not be a replica as it doesn't look like the official strike).  Given the rich history in India, there were several private coins and tokens issued around this time.  I don't have any references to look up the list of known private coins and temple tokens that were issued in India, but Mitchiner published the following book which might have these types of coins listed:

Indian Tokens: Popular Religious and Secular Art from the Ancient Period to the Present Day

This might seem like a rant or a "much ado about nothing", but it is important to look at all angles before applying a blanket statement that the coin is fake.  This is what makes Indian Numismatics fascinating. There are too many unknowns and hence difficult for collectors...

Good luck,

Ram

Dear Sirs

I Agree with Quant Greek and may add that even in that period, the Original Temple Coins were not exact Replicas-- they were used as alternate currencies by those who were against the Colonial Occupation - that is why the Flag was deliberately Crossed-- Temple Coins were banned by law when the British Crown took over the reins of India from the EIC in 1857.

I'm genuinely interested in Scientific and/or Historic perspective here not random Opinions...







   
    
 

Citação: JDCOINthe Original Temple Coins were not exact Replicas-- they were used as alternate currencies by those who were against the Colonial Occupation - that is why the Flag was deliberately Crossed-- Temple Coins were banned by law when the British Crown took over the reins of India from the EIC in 1857.

I'm genuinely interested in Scientific and/or Historic perspective here not random Opinions...

The fundamental problem here is something I have uttered too many times in too many forums.  Read the primary and secondary sources BEFORE posting non-sense and hearsay.  This seems to be a fundamental problem with Indian Numismatics.  NOBODY WANTS TO READ A BOOK!!!  There are tons of great books out there on Indian history and numismatics that explains a lot of this and a lot of the good ones are actually freely available on Google and archive.org.  Instead, people post comments from numerous forums without any verification of the information.  

Semantics.

Maybe it's a language thing.

The coin is an unofficial strike?
Considered a token?
Therefore, it's not the coin it pretends to be.

Which is what we consider a fake, it is pretending to be an EIC 1835 1/2 Anna, which it isn't.

Being rude to people, calling them ignorant, N00bs or whatever isn't helping anyone, in fact you may get a few backs up.

Is it just coincidence that there's two people here, joined within a few days of each other, both "experts" in Indian coins, arguing that this coin is a genuine replica token?

Citação: BizzoDoesSemantics.

Maybe it's a language thing.

The coin is an unofficial strike?
Considered a token?
Therefore, it's not the coin it pretends to be.

Which is what we consider a fake, it is pretending to be an EIC 1835 1/2 Anna, which it isn't.

Being rude to people, calling them ignorant, N00bs or whatever isn't helping anyone, in fact you may get a few backs up.

Is it just coincidence that there's two people here, joined within a few days of each other, both "experts" in Indian coins, arguing that this coin is a genuine replica token?

It is not semantics, but a numismatic terminology.  What most people label as fake are "modern replicas" designed to dupe collectors.  I never said that it was genuine nor did I say I was an "expert".  What I said was that it needs to be determined further and hence researched accordingly.  I don't collect these types of coins, so I don't know.  As I indicated earlier, in regards to authenticity, "I will leave that to others to answer".  So, no I am not indicating that this coin is a genuine replica token...

Labeling something as "fake" has a very negative connotation with collectors.  It prompts them to avoid it and move on.  That is the problem with labels.  Using more correct terminology avoids these problems.  You should be avoiding modern replicas, but not contemporary imitations, tokens, and private issuances.  There are several "contemporary imitations" that are far more valuable that the original coins.  And the same applies to tokens and private coins.  But, by all means, avoid modern replicas unless you collect those as well    

The term you used "genuine replica token" made me laugh out loud, it makes absolutely no sense.

Citação: neilithicThe term you used "genuine replica token" made me laugh out loud, it makes absolutely no sense.

A classic oxymoron   . I think I need to post some pictures to show the differences between these classes of coins.  I have a class of private, official as well as contemporary imitation of a series of Chinese Cash coins that I can post.  Finding a modern replica on the net should be easy  

Citação: Quant.Geek

Citação: BizzoDoesSemantics.

Maybe it's a language thing.

The coin is an unofficial strike?
Considered a token?
Therefore, it's not the coin it pretends to be.

Which is what we consider a fake, it is pretending to be an EIC 1835 1/2 Anna, which it isn't.

Being rude to people, calling them ignorant, N00bs or whatever isn't helping anyone, in fact you may get a few backs up.

Is it just coincidence that there's two people here, joined within a few days of each other, both "experts" in Indian coins, arguing that this coin is a genuine replica token?

It is not semantics, but a numismatic terminology.  What most people label as fake are "modern replicas" designed to dupe collectors.  I never said that it was genuine nor did I say I was an "expert".  What I said was that it needs to be determined further and hence researched accordingly.  I don't collect these types of coins, so I don't know.  As I indicated earlier, in regards to authenticity, "I will leave that to others to answer".  So, no I am not indicating that this coin is a genuine replica token...

Labeling something as "fake" has a very negative connotation with collectors.  It prompts them to avoid it and move on.  That is the problem with labels.  Using more correct terminology avoids these problems.  You should be avoiding modern replicas, but not contemporary imitations, tokens, and private issuances.  There are several "contemporary imitations" that are far more valuable that the original coins.  And the same applies to tokens and private coins.  But, by all means, avoid modern replicas unless you collect those as well  

Here are some examples that i could think of,

Modern fantasy Token (But not a Fake): https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces65301.html

Contemporary (So-Called Temple) Token (But not a Fake): https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces60286.html

Modern Fantasy coin designed to fool collectors (A Fake): https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces57561.html

Modern replica of Tipu Sultan Fanam (A Fake): http://coins.ha.com/itm/india/world-coins/india-mysore-tipu-sultan-gold-fanam-nd-xf-/a/231504-64245.s

So, to be a little more concrete, the first three coins are collectible and the second and third coins are classified as rare.  The last coin is a "modern replica".  This is why it is important to know what you are talking about.  If I called the second and third coins "fake", most people would pass them by.  Those two coins are far more valuable than the first coin!!!  The first coin costs about $10 whereas the second coin costs about $50-$100 and finally the third coin is about $150 and above.  The first three coins are in my collection whereas the last one is not...

Here is a genuine, official strike of a 開元通寳 Kai Yuan tong bao from the Tang Dynasty:



In comparison, here is a private issuance from Japan that mimics the Kai Yuan tong bao.  This is the so-called Shima-Sen coins.  It means "coins of unknown origin":



Here is another imitation, but from Central Asia (another genuine coin), specifically Sogdiana:




Here is a "modern replica" of a Kai Yuan:

@Quant.Geek - as a mod on another coin site, you should know that calling people N00bs, especially for a new member here, is only going to cause a flame. We tend to have a number of scammers on here, so, although you and Mr Dutta may be completely genuine (which you probably are), but having two very new members both disagreeing with some very well respected members, just makes me think you're in cahoots (which you're probably not).

And yes, my "genuine replica token" comment was meant to be a little facetious, apologies. It's just that the OP said that it's a rare EIC 1835 half anna, some say it's a "fake" then others have argued that it's not a fake because it might be a contemporary token, or not a fake because it might be an unofficial strike.

This thread is 9 months old, the OP only stayed here a couple of weeks, the other thread he started was asking to identify what turned out to be a tourist token, maybe this is one as well.

Yes, I agree that using the correct terminology will stop people using the word fake in the wrong context, not everyone know the correct terminology, myself included, I've learned a lot over the past year on this forum, especially with the help of people like sujit_kumar (see his post above), taking the time to try to explain the differences to novices like myself.

(Edit: and thanks for your explanation too, which I've just seen)

Citação: BizzoDoes@Quant.Geek - as a mod on another coin site, you should know that calling people N00bs, especially for a new member here, is only going to cause a flame. We tend to have a number of scammers on here, so, although you and Mr Dutta may be completely genuine (which you probably are), but having two very new members both disagreeing with some very well respected members, just makes me think you're in cahoots (which you're probably not).

I agree that it was probably uncalled for, but it was meant as a general statement and not aimed at anyone specific.  I will gladly rescind the remark and to make it clear I have no intention of duping anyone.  For those who know me, I have always tried to provide standard references to back up my claims and anything that is my opinion, I state it as such.  I have been collecting for well over thirty years and it is from experience and from my personal collection that I wrote what I said.

Citação: BizzoDoesYes, I agree that using the correct terminology will stop people using the word fake in the wrong context, not everyone know the correct terminology, myself included, I've learned a lot over the past year on this forum, especially with the help of people like sujit_kumar (see his post above), taking the time to try to explain the differences to novices like myself.

(Edit: and thanks for your explanation too, which I've just seen)

Most beginners don't venture into the private issuances, tokens, and contemporary imitations and hence it takes a more sophisticated collector to know this.  So, when someone says its fake, you got to take it with a grain of salt.  Going back to this EIC half anna, I am not qualified to determine whether or not it is safe to collect as I normally stick with the official strikes for British India coinage...

The fundamental problem here is something I have uttered too many times in too many forums.  Read the primary and secondary sources BEFORE posting non-sense and hearsay.  This seems to be a fundamental problem with Indian Numismatics.  NOBODY WANTS TO READ A BOOK!!!  There are tons of great books out there on Indian history and numismatics that explains a lot of this and a lot of the good ones are actually freely available on Google and archive.org.  Instead, people post comments from numerous forums without any verification of the information.  

Dear Sirs
Even though I do agree with yr explanation on Contemporary Replica and the later posts with pics-- the Temple tokens/coins fall into a diff class by itself as they were genuinely used (even though unofficially) in exchange for goods & services (which is the broad definition of 'Currency')-- talking about books, I happen to have written a Non-fiction (not on Numismatics though) which is available in Amazon-- so I have this bad habit of always checking out the Primary Source- but the assertion that it is 'problem with Indian Numismatics' sounds like a stereotype generalization and believe the same to be in bad taste and perhaps shud be avoided.
By the way I'm sorry to hv uploaded a wrong coin pic so I hereby upload 3 lion EIC half anna for comparison:

to me a "token" or replica that's supposedto look like am offical coin is a fake a coin that's unoffical is token and the coin in the top of the thread is a fake

Citação: kolikko99to me a "token" or replica that's supposed to look like am offical coin is a fake a coin that's unoffical is token and the coin in the top of the thread is a fake

Again, that is a very simplistic view in numismatics.  You really must differentiate between modern replica/modern fantasy coins with everything else.  When I post that a coin is "fake", I really mean that it is a modern replica/modern fantasy coin.  It is a very strict definition.  Using your definition, the Shima-Sen coin I posted above is a "fake" due to the fact that it looks like an official Kai Yuan coin, but it is not. The shima-sen coins are widely known and hence widely published in Japanese coin catalogs since at least the 1900s.  

Now, we need to determine when that Anna was struck.  If it was struck recently, then it is a modern fantasy coin.  However, if it was struck much earlier, then it is a legitimate numismatic item.  Now using google, I was able to find several unofficial remarks about that Anna indicating that it was recently issued by various tantriks for religious purposes.  I do not have any formal references to back this claim.  So, given that, it might very well be a modern fantasy coin...

Citação: JDCOINthe assertion that it is 'problem with Indian Numismatics' sounds like a stereotype generalization and believe the same to be in bad taste and perhaps shud be avoided.

It is a general statement that seems to be prevalent in Indian numismatics.  Note, that I am an Indian American and hence it is based on what I have seen in the past decade of coin collecting.  In numerous forums, I have posted links to primary and secondary sources on Indian numismatics, but recent collectors don't even bother reading them.  Answers to fundamental questions on legends, authenticity, etc have all been written decades ago, but it is ignored and forum after forum, we see the same questions.  When I originally started collecting coins thirty years ago, the first thing I did was to purchase a copy of the RED BOOK, but nowadays, rarely does anyone read a book...

Citação: Leo111Hey plz identify this coin 1835 cross flag it's very rare coin help me out

just accept the fact that this is fake

Citação: kolikko99

Citação: Leo111Hey plz identify this coin 1835 cross flag it's very rare coin help me out

just accept the fact that this is fake

I will say this as plainly as possible, it is NOT an official strike.  We should all know this by now as it is not listed in any standard references (i.e., Krause, Poole, etc).  That should weed out 95% of the collectors as they typically stick with official strikes.  

As for what it is afterwards, I DO NOT KNOW, but if you want to split the numismatic world into black and white, then yes, it is a "fake"...

Here's Expert Jan Lingen's view on these types of tokens:

"These medalic tokens are fantasy pieces. The appeared on the market sometime during the late 1980’s. They have a large variety of religious motifs on the obverse. On the reverse one often find a reference to the East India Company, a denomination and sometimes a date too.
The earliest pieces are of quite good workmanship, often with a milled edge, with all kind of religious motifs, but they became more and more crude. Some mention a place name Ratlam. Perhaps they were (and probably still are) manufactured there.
The majority of the pieces, which I have seen, bear mostly a ‘date’ 1818, but it seems they have gone back in time by adding a ‘date’ 1616. A ‘date’ 1839 is also popular on these pieces.
The monkey with the scales and the two cats represent a popular children’s story. Two cats quarrelled about food. So the monkey would try to equally divide it, but every time the scale got out of balance, the monkey tried to get it in balance by eating the food from the heavier side. This went on and on, till nothing was left. The morality of the story you can fill-in yourself.
These pieces can in general be regarded as religious motivated tokens. Their references to the East India Company is purely fantasy, as are the dates on them.
But for the price of approximately $ 2.00 it makes an interesting collecting as you may find almost the whole Indian pantheon or popular folk themes on them.
They are a continuation of a long standing Indian tradition of all kind of religious tokens."

Source: http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php?topic=1277.0

A modern fantasy piece then   .  Thanks Sujit, I should have searched WoC, but this post ended up becoming circular with people who are "stuck in the mud" in regards to definitions...

Citação: Quant.GeekA modern fantasy piece then   .  Thanks Sujit, I should have searched WoC, but this post ended up become circular with people who are "stuck in the mud" in regards to definitions...

Dear Sirs
There is no need to jump to conclusions-- what Mr Sujit Kumar refered to are the Obvious Mordern Replicas of the Temple Token like the Hanuman, Monkey & Scale, Hindu Deities etc with dates like 1616, 1717, 1818, etc. with denominations of One or Half Anna which have flooded the Markets/ Sites including EBay. That does not prove that Original Temple tokens did not exist-- An example of it is the 'Ramtanka' which were in existence  from the 18th Century and did not Replicate any other contemporary currency-- since I'm travelling, do not hv the time to find the references but if anyone has the time --I'm uploading pics of two of them in my possession in Silver & Brass-- pls dig and you shall know what I mean.

No one is saying ALL temple tokens are modern fantasy pieces.  It is only the ones with dates like 1616, etc as you indicate.  For legitimate temple tokens, I suggest you read Mitchiner's excellent book which I posted earlier.  It includes the pieces you mention:

Indian Tokens: Popular Religious and Secular Art from the Ancient Period to the Present Day

The initial poster asked about this "coin" so anyone saying it is a fake is strictly speaking correct since tokens are not coins, but that's just semantics.  

I tend not to collect anything that I can't easily pick a fake.  Since I don't know much about ancient Roman, Greek etc coins, Indian princely states and Chinese cash coins I tend to stay away from them.  I would recommend most people adopt a similar philosphy.  There are too many fakes around especially of the Indian and Chinese coins that you're likely to get ripped off unless you know what you're doing.

correct, I agree Neilithic
Here is a nice link on Ram Durbar and replicas
http://indiannumismatics.com/products.php?id=152

This is a very interesting thread and there are some references that I am going to have to track down.  What I gather from the conversation in the thread is that there is a much larger grey area in Indian coins (and apparently in other Eastern countries) then there is in Western coins.

Or at least the grey is not as sharply defined as people are used to.  For example, we are used to dealing with hard time tokens, condor tokens, and good for's, but these are in a different category than official coinage (and relegated to the token ghetto with Chuck e Cheese tokens on the website).  Italian phone tokens are a close comparison because with the inflation they did circulate as a currency as the had an assigned value.

The lesson to learn is if you want to collect more specialised things like the temple tokens and non official coinage you need to do your reasearch, read up about your topic, lean to identify them yourself, well enough that you can pick the genuine article out of the fakes and reproductions.

neilithic,

Your suggestion applies to everything including official coinage and hence it is a very good advice from a wise man  

regards,

Ram

Yes it pays to know what you're buying in all aspects of collecting, but the specialised coins and tokens tend to be more expensive than the standard official coinage so it's a more worth your while to get clued up about what's real or not.  But in saying that, I'm always going to be doing plenty of research on any coin that I'm paying more than $20 for  

Citação: jadejackalWhat I gather from the conversation in the thread is that there is a much larger grey area in Indian coins (and apparently in other Eastern countries) then there is in Western coins.

That is not entirely true.  In colonial America, each state had their own form of currency and they also recognized private issuances, tokens, foreign currency and in some cases, currencies from other states.  This produced a very interesting experience in commerce.  The standardization of money was one of the primary goals of the Continental Congress in the early years of the United States.  This was established in the constitution under Article One, Section Eight:

Congress has the authority to "coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures"...

and thereby revoking the right to coin money by the individual states. Among the popular foreign currency that was recognized universally in all the states was the Spanish Milled Dollar.  For instance, this Rhode Island currency from my collection pays out in Spanish Milled Dollars.  Furthermore, the United States unified in a much shorter time frame than India, whereas the latter took several hundred years to become a single unified country.  So, in India, local coinages were abundant for a long period of time...

Most countries have non-official but legal tender coinage.  New Zealand has all the tradesmen's tokens that were minted to make up for the shortage of small denomination coins, UK also had the tradesmen's tokens that were minted for the same reason as well as evasion coinage which circulated along with the genuine coins and tradesmen's tokens.

Yes: unofficial coins and especially those in India are Uncharted Territory with No Experts and No Catalogues and the little info in Books & the Net are only the Tip of the Iceberg-- but if you can navigate thru the sea of Fakes, there is Value underneath. Just to put on the perspective: I have 16 official EIC coins (9 Silver + 7 Copper/Brass) and only 9 Temple Tokens but the Value of just the One Silver Ramtanka is more than all my EIC Collection. I had tried to Research the subject 7 years back when I started collecting the Temple Tokens and I still have no definitive answer. But I did find a way to track the Modern Replicas and I wud like to share this with you all-- Other than qualitative differences (textures, weight, diameter, etc) almost all the Fake Temple Coins/ Modern Replicas have either UK or UKL in the Reverse side: just like this Fake Cross Flag Coin as under:

JDCoin,

That is not 100% true.  There are several reverses that do not have either UK nor UKL like the coin in the original post.  Furthermore, I strongly suggest you pick up Mitchiner's book on this topic.  I have most of his books, but not this particular one since I am not into collecting tokens, religious medals, etc.  Apparently, Mitchiner just published a more up-to-date version of the earlier book I mentioned:

Mitchiner, M., Indian Medals, Tokens, Pictorial Plaques and Pendants ca. 1800 - 2010  

and it is pretty massive at 944 pages with nearly 3,000 items identified!  It includes the silver Ramatankas and EIC-like jewelers pieces, etc. So, if anyone is interested in these types of exonumia-type stuff, then they should pick up this book, but it is a bit expensive for the casual collector at around $250...

Regards,

Ram

Citação: Quant.GeekJDCoin,

That is not 100% true.  There are several reverses that do not have either UK nor UKL like the coin in the original post.  Furthermore, I strongly suggest you pick up Mitchiner's book on this topic.  I have most of his books, but not this particular one since I am not into collecting tokens, religious medals, etc.  Apparently, Mitchiner just published a more up-to-date version of the earlier book I mentioned....

Dear Mr Ram

I did use the word 'almost', what I meant was that by steering clear of the UK & UKL versions, one can easily avoid the bulk of fakes but obviously there wud be others, some may even look exactly like the Originals- an 'occupational hazard' that hv to be dealt on individual merit- at the end of the day, we buy coins not pics.

Yes I did go thru Mitchiner's 1998 edition along with Irwin's on the subject and both have acknowledged that there are many hundred more that have been buried in time and waiting to be unearthed.

Academics aside, I wud be grateful if you or anyone in the forum cud give me an idea as to how much this EIC Official Error Coin Victoria Divided Legend) could be worth? (Not for Sale though)

Citação: JDCOINAcademics aside, I wud be grateful if you or anyone in the forum cud give me an idea as to how much this EIC Official Error Coin Victoria Divided Legend) could be worth? (Not for Sale though)

What type of error do you think the coin went through?  It seems like it is more of a mutilation that occurred after minting.  That would indicate that it is just a damaged coin, unless there is something else I missed in the coin...

Citação: Quant.Geek

Citação: JDCOINAcademics aside, I wud be grateful if you or anyone in the forum cud give me an idea as to how much this EIC Official Error Coin Victoria Divided Legend) could be worth? (Not for Sale though)

What type of error do you think the coin went through?  It seems like it is more of a mutilation that occurred after minting.  That would indicate that it is just a damaged coin, unless there is something else I missed in the coin...

Obverse : definitely Damaged
Reverse: Clipped Planchet error perhaps

Citação: JDCOINObverse : definitely Damaged
Reverse: Clipped Planchet error perhaps

Definitely not.  It seems to have been mutilated after minting as though someone tried to do a "cheap" counterstamp after circulation.  But don't take this to mean it is a counterstamp!  Without a higher-resolution image of the details of the "mutilation", it is difficult to determine if it is an official counterstamp or something else...

Citação: Quant.Geek

Citação: JDCOINObverse : definitely Damaged
Reverse: Clipped Planchet error perhaps

Definitely not.  It seems to have been mutilated after minting as though someone tried to do a "cheap" counterstamp after circulation.  But don't take this to mean it is a counterstamp!  Without a higher-resolution image of the details of the "mutilation", it is difficult to determine if it is an official counterstamp or something else...

Tks a lot--- Perhaps I should check it out with the Reserve Bank of India...

The coin was probably used as a coat button or a cufflink, the circle looks like remains of solder where the hook or clasp was attached....

Citação: @josephjkThe coin was probably used as a coat button or a cufflink, the circle looks like remains of solder where the hook or clasp was attached....

That is more plausible, especially when the "damage" is dead-center to the coin...

Yes: people do use gold coins for Pendants so why not a cuff-link/ coat button... I had bought it at an RBI Auction @US$25 --it is sometimes so difficult to judge coins in an auction situation... nevertheless, I'll still give it a shot with RBI and/or the Calcutta Mint.

Citação: JDCOINYes: people do use gold coins for Pendants so why not a cuff-link/ coat button... I had bought it at an RBI Auction @US$25 --it is sometimes so difficult to judge coins in an auction situation... nevertheless, I'll still give it a shot with RBI and/or the Calcutta Mint.

Prices for British India coins are just ridiculous and not sustainable.  I bought my 1840 1/4 Rupee in uncirculated condition for about $10-$15 several years ago and the dealer had a full roll of these coins!  BI coins are like the housing market in the US, everyone is getting into it without even knowing how to collect coins.  It will likely crash soon, just like the housing market did .  Even the prices for BI coin have come down in recent months in comparison to a few years ago...

Prices for British India coins are just ridiculous and not sustainable.  I bought my 1840 1/4 Rupee in uncirculated condition for about $10-$15 several years ago and the dealer had a full roll of these coins!  BI coins are like the housing market in the US, everyone is getting into it without even knowing how to collect coins.  It will likely crash soon, just like the housing market did .  Even the prices for BI coin have come down in recent months in comparison to a few years ago...
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Ha Ha- well said-- It is exactly the same phenomenon in India- but it may not necessarily be a bad thing-- as more and more people start Collecting (unwittingly perhaps), the Demand Cycle will sore up and eventually increase the Price-- Also, the Low Mintage (High Value) Coins (most of these 'Silver Rupee' --I possess) like the 1997 Victoria, 1911/1922 George V, 1910 Edward VII, 1938/1939 George VI, etc, will survive this onslaught...

Citação: JDCOINHa Ha- well said-- It is exactly the same phenomenon in India- but it may not necessarily be a bad thing-- as more and more people start Collecting (unwittingly perhaps), the Demand Cycle will sore up and eventually increase the Price-- Also, the Low Mintage (High Value) Coins (most of these 'Silver Rupee' --I possess) like the 1997 Victoria, 1911/1922 George V, 1910 Edward VII, 1938/1939 George VI, etc, will survive this onslaught...

Rare coins will always survive, even if the price drops a bit.  However, the so-called "more and more people" are not all true collectors and are pretty much trolls who are trying to cash in on this numismatic wave.  They will fade once the market dies and hence will move on to something else.  The true collectors will endure once the system gets a reboot.  I am desperately waiting for this to happen as a lot of the early trolls damaged a lot of good coins by making them "nice and shinny"